Traveling Pointing Dogs

Finally, the weather is cooling down a little. It’s really hard to work dogs when the temperature is 80 degrees at 6:00 am. This last week we have mornings in the sixties. A lot better for the dogs but fifties would be better but we’ll take what we can get.

Abby with a dowel dummy.

Abby with a plastic bumper.

Abby with a plastic dummy.

I moved the dogs off the bench several weeks ago. They have been doing their retrieves on the ground and I usually use a tennis ball. I have a stump near the kennels that I have them jump on after they chase the tennis ball down. Abby really enjoys this exercise, in fact she is way ahead of Boss on retrieving.

At first on the bench, Boss was doing better than Abby. Then it all changed. Abby started going down the bench pretty fast to get the dummies. Boss slowed to a crawl. I’m not sure what caused the change. On the bench, near the end of the time they worked on the bench, they would retrieve 6 or 7 dummies then I would do the same on the ground right beside the bench. Abby went pretty fast and seldom dropped the dummy once she picked it up.

Boss slowed even more. I think a turtle would have passed him in route to the dummy. But he would hold until I told him to give. And as long as he was making an effort I let him move at his on pace. If he didn’t start when I said, “fetch” stimulation came on. But at a real low level. But I had to walk out with him, usually.

When I moved them to the stump near the kennels I noticed that Boss would never go in front of me to make a retrieve. I had to walk out with him. So I started heeling him out and throwing the tennis ball to his side. Just a few feet. He got used to going away from me to make the retrieve and I started throwing to the side and a little in front. After several days I was throwing the ball straight in front of him and he was going for it.

Abby liked the tennis ball from the get go. She would run out scoop it up and return. Just before she got to me I said, “up” and she would jump onto the stump. When she held the dummy until I said, “give”. I would feed her a slice of hot dog. Earlier I used dog treats that I bought at various pet stores. Slicing a hot dog into 18 or 20 pieces seemed to work better for me. And Abby will do almost anything if she thinks she will get a treat.

Boss with a plastic dummy.

When I offered Boss a treat either on the bench or the stump he might lick it but he wouldn’t eat it. I kept trying to get him interested in the treats. One time at the vet’s office I asked Dr. Becker to check to see if there was anything wrong with his teeth or his bite or whatever. When he did take a treat it took a while for him to chew it up. Dr. Becker found nothing wrong.

Most mornings I work Mann and Sally on retrieving and give them a treat when they retrieve and hold until I say, “give”. And then Abby earns treats. Whatever is left at the end of the training session I divide between the dogs. I open their gates and feed them their share as they stand on their house. Boss would take a treat then but he still didn’t just scarf it down.

When Sally and Mann retrieve I use a Dokken quail dummy. This morning, because Abby has been doing real well on the tennis ball, I decided to see what she would do with the quail dummy. It made no difference to her. She ran out out scooped it up and jumped onto the stump. I said, “give” and took the dummy and threw it again. She’s doing real well so I only threw it 4 times before letting run for a few minutes.

Boss with a dowel dummy.

After she’s made a couple of laps around the yard I sit on the stump and pet her. I give her a few treats while I tell her what a good girl she is. Then I put her back in the kennel.

This morning with Boss, I tossed the tennis ball when I heeled him out near the stump. He acted like he didn’t see it so the stimulation came on. He thought, “oh, I remember. That tennis ball is right there”. He slowly walked to it, picked it up and came back to the stump. He didn’t get on right away. I had to say, “up”, forcefully, before he jumped onto the stump. The next 4 or 5 retrieves he trotted out, slowly picked the ball up and trotted back to the stump. Some of the time he would jump on without me saying anything and sometimes he waited for me to say, “up”. I offered a treat but he just turned his head.

Because he’s so slow and hard headed he has to do more retrieves than Abby. Then I follow him with the 4-wheeler as he makes a couple of rounds, extremely fast, around the yard. After a couple of laps around the yard I sit on the stump and pet him. He doesn’t just stand in front as the other dogs do he wants in my lap. And I let him.

Boss, not happy, but holding the dowel.

This morning as I petted him I offered him a slice of hot dog and he scarfed it down. That is the first time he has taken a treat when he wasn’t in his kennel. I gave him another and it disappeared instantly.

If I can get him to liking the treats maybe he will retrieve for a treat. It works on the others. Sally and Mann know if they don’t wait until I reach for the dummy, if they drop the dummy, they don’t get a treat. Sally is learning the same lesson. Boss, in my opinion, likes the treats but he isn’t selling out that cheap.

Sally waiting for me to take the dummy and give her a treat.

But after this morning, and him taking the treats by the stump, he may start trading a bumper for a treat. Abby, Sally and Mann have learned to enjoy retrieving by me using the treats. Although Mann just started accepting the treats a few weeks ago. He would occasionally accept one but he was more interested in being petted. Whatever works.

Abby and Boss are half brother and sister. They are out of Sally but Abby’s dad is a son of Tekoa Mountain Sunrise and Mann is Boss’s dad. But even dogs from the same litter are very different, sometimes, in what it takes to train them. I could put a lot of pressure on Boss but I might take something out of him. Or I might completely ruin him. June said I shouldn’t have named him Boss. He actually thinks he’s the boss. Maybe so.

Three weeks from today some of the prairie states will be opening their grouse seasons. While right now, the weather is still hot, hopefully, it will be a lot cooler by September the first. I will be watching several different state’s weather to see if it will be conducive to taking the dogs safely, for a few days. For the dogs to be comfortable, in the dog boxes, the day time weather must be fairly cool.

Sally center, Mann on the left honoring Ally on the right.

Vince with Abby honoring Sally.

Boss honoring.

Yesterday Vince Dye and I took some of my pigeons to a friend of his farm, to work the dogs. This was a large farm mostly in CRP. About a third of it had been mowed leaving some strips to walk through and some taller stuff to hide the birds in. The taller grass could not have been any wetter if it had just rained 2 or 3 inches. I had taken my rubber boots to keep my feet dry but found out before I got the first bird hid that my left boot was leaking. By the time I got back to the truck to put the e-collar and GPS collar on Abby my feet were both drenched. Both boots leaked.

With the first two birds we didn’t use the release traps. I thought it would be more realistic for the dogs to put the birds to sleep and just hide them in the grass. Vince went to a strip of tall grass to the right front and I went to left front of the truck.

When I got Abby ready we started toward the birds. Vince was a little way in front of me and I could see he was already wet to his knees. He said his boots were leaking too.

Abby knew that there were birds in front of her and she was not leaving anything unchecked. She made a couple of unproductive points long before she got to the birds we had hidden. With all of the moisture and a slight wind the scenting conditions were excellent, I think. She didn’t stay on her unproductive points long but moved ahead. When she got close to the first bird she pointed, and stayed. As we got closer she took a step. I whoaed her and set her back. I took a picture with my phone then walked in front of her. I woke the pigeon and it just took a step or two and stopped. I bumped it with my toe and it flew about 5 feet and Abby had it before it could land.

I called Abby but she was excited and playing with the pigeon. She did pick it up and carry it a short distance but not to me. I let her play for a few seconds then called her but she paid no attention. It was her bird. She found it and she caught it. After a few seconds she left the bird and went back to hunting.

Boss pointing Abby honoring.

I picked up the pigeon and followed her. She pointed the next pigeon but took a couple of steps. I set her back and whoaed her then told Vince to flush the bird and shoot it while I held Abby. I had my shot gun in one hand and I held her collar with the other. I have had Abby her whole life. I should know her. She’s close to 60 pounds and extremely strong. I thought she wouldn’t try to get the pigeon with me holding her collar. Vince flushed the pigeon and it flew about 3 feet and Abby had it. I flew farther than the pigeon did. She rolled me completely over in the grass. My gun and I both were wet from end to end, from the dew.

But Vince was nice about it. While I was still on the ground he patted my shoulder and said, “You did a really nice job holding that dog”. I think what I said was, “Thanks, Vince”. Vince may have thought I said something different but that was probably what I said.

I had brought some release traps so our next birds were placed in those. I had caught these birds before daylight and most of them were really young. I didn’t know how young but most weren’t good flyers. We worked Allie, Vince’s short haired pointer, next.

Boss

Allie was checking everything as she went in front of us. She was well off the bird when she pointed then she moved. Vince whoaed her but she moved again. Vince picked her up and set her back. She looked really nice and didn’t move again. I took a picture of her with my phone. I had another camera with me that I could have put the pictures on the blog but I never pulled it out. When I flushed this young bird, out of the release trap, it tried to light on Vince’s gun barrel. He had to pull the gun back and the bird tried to fly away but he dropped it with a good shot.

Allie scooped the pigeon up and started back toward Vince but stopped short. I was close and knelt down and called her. She didn’t come to me, either. That seemed to confuse her. I shouldn’t have tried to call his dog. After a minute or so she quit playing with the bird and went back to hunting.

Allie went around the field until she hit the scent cone on the next bird. She pointed then moved circling the bird. She pointed several times before we got to her. She never tried to move in she was just moving in a circle around the bird. Vince set her back in the original spot. Then he walked back and forth in front of her kicking the cover. Once he sets her back and styles her up she doesn’t move. I flushed the pigeon when Vince nodded at me. This bird went my way and dropped at my shot. Allie scooped it up and dropped it just a step or two in front of Vince.

Abby pointing a pigeon.

We reloaded the release traps and turned Boss out next. Boss is really fast. He went over the hill in front of us and I just knew he was on point. He was but he had not got close to the bird in front of us but had crossed to the next bird and was pointing it. He was well off the bird and when I got close he took a step. I whoaed him then set him back.

After I walked in front of him for a few seconds I flushed the pigeon but it landed right beside the trap. Boss stood taller and more rigid. He didn’t try to move. Vince tried to get the bird to fly but it just ran in the tall grass. Boss couldn’t take it. He ran the bird down and grabbed it. Then he let it go but followed it in a circle in the tall grass. I knelt down and when the bird got close to me I grabbed it. We went after the other bird.

When we got close Boss pointed but he was quite away from the bird. In fact I wasn’t sure exactly where the bird was but when I went in front of him I didn’t see it. I tapped him on the head and he moved to the side, about 20 yards and pointed again. This time I saw the release trap. I stroked him a few times then walked in front kicking the grass. I flushed the pigeon and it lit right beside the trap. Again, Boss just stood a little taller and more rigid. I stroked his sides then tapped his head. He grabbed the bird and played with it for a few seconds then went back to hunting.

Mann after the pigeon had flown.

We picked up the release traps and drove to another area of the CRP patch. This time I drove the edge of the tall grass and when we saw an area where we thought was a good place we stopped the truck and hid a bird. After we placed both release traps with a bird in each I turned Abby out again. As she ran through the tall grass she was almost on top of the first bird when she hit the scent cone. I set her back from the trap a few feet. I styled her up then kicked the grass around the release trap. I flushed the pigeon and missed my first shot but with a lucky second shot the pigeon tumbled from the air. Abby grabbed the bird but only played with it for a few seconds before going back to hunting.

We went on down the hill and Abby pointed again. This time she was quite a way ahead and moved before we could get close. Then she moved two more times before I got to her. I had whoaed her but she did what she wanted instead of minding me. I set her back then walked in front kicking the grass. I made her stay on point while I kicked for a minute or so. I flushed the bird and Vince made a good shot. Abby pounced on the bird and took it away from me. She finally dropped it and went back to hunting. I had to call her in and have her hunt dead to find the bird.

Mann on point Sally and Abby honoring.

I had to put Abby up but there was no reason for Vince to walk all the way to the truck. I told him to wait for me and I went to the truck, put Abby in the box then drove to where Vince was. He put a pigeon in the release trap and we drove back to the other trap and reloaded it. Then we drove back to the starting point. If we had of thought of this earlier we wouldn’t be as wet as we are.

Vince turned Allie out. We had moved the first bird down the hill a little way to take advantage of the light breeze we had. Allie made a nice stylish point on the bird. Then she took a step. Vince set her back and styled her up. She didn’t move again. Vince walked in front of her kicking the cover. When he was ready I flushed the bird. He missed with the first shot but scored with the second. Allie ran to the bird, scooped it up and brought it close to Vince. Not all the way but she’s getting closer. She went back to hunting.

These dogs almost seem to know where we hide these birds. Abby had done it and Allie crossed out of this patch of tall grass to the next patch where we had hidden the next bird. We were still quite a way back when she pointed. Then she moved. Then a couple more times. Vince picked her up and carried her back. He kicked quite a while with her standing real steady waiting for us to flush the bird. When he nodded I flushed the bird. He made a good shot and Allie grabbed the bird. She ran close and then away before dropping the bird. Vince picked the bird up, tossed it a few feet and said, “fetch”. That didn’t work either. She grabbed the pigeon but didn’t bring it all the way back.

Abby really concentrating on this honor.

Vince said she does really well in the yard with bumpers but it takes a little while for them to realize that they need to bring birds to us.

Since Vince had to put Allie up I waited for him to drive down to me. I reloaded the release traps and when we got back to the start area I turned Boss out again. Boss pointed the first bird without moving. I stroked his sides, telling him what a good boy he is, then walked in front kicking the cover. This bird came out of the trap flying really well but I made a lucky shot. I had to walk through floating feathers to get near where the bird had fallen. Boss pushed it a few times with his nose then went back to hunting.

He crossed out of this patch without hunting all of it just like the other two had done. He went to the next bird and pointed. He took a step before I got there. I set him back and stroked him up. I flushed the pigeon after kicking the cover for a few seconds. Vince made another good shot. Boss went to the dead bird and nosed it around without even picking it up. He went back to hunting.

John and Vince.

We went back to the truck, took the e-collars and GPS collars off the dogs and headed home. The last two times we have used the pigeons the dogs have moved on their points. I thought maybe it was the release traps. That’s the reason I wanted to just put the birds to sleep. But they wouldn’t fly. They didn’t fly real well out of the release traps but it was better. We may work the dogs here at the house on some birds and try to steady them some but we’ve also got some chukars coming next month. Most of the time the chukars don’t need release traps. But Vince, the dogs and I really enjoyed the day we had.

This site was down for several days due to some unforeseen circumstances. I have to pay a hosting company for the posts to be online. I pay 3 years at a time and the expiration date on the credit card I used had changed. So when they didn’t have the right date the payment was rejected. Or maybe I have a totally new card. Anyway, when they didn’t get paid, without notifying me, they just shut it down.

Boss pointing a pigeon.

Abby

Abby pointing a pigeon.

So Sunday I spent about an hour talking with a really nice guy that I could hardly understand. But he also had trouble understanding me. I got my card updated and he told me it might take a while for my blog to be up, again. It wasn’t back online this morning so about noon I called. After about an hour with another nice man the blog is back up and running. I’m sorry that this happened. But now I’m set for 3 more years.

The weather all across the United States, maybe the world, has been really hot. Except us last week. We had some really nice cool mornings and less humidity and temperatures. I worked the dogs early and then did a bunch of stuff on my house during the cool daytime temperatures. That’s the reason for no posts on the blog for a while. Well, our cool weather is over. So back to just working the dogs for a few minutes and not letting them do too much running. Another month and the weather should be better.

This morning I threw the Dokken quail dummy for Sally and Mann several times. It was already near 80 degrees so I didn’t let Sally run. I sat on the tree stump and petted her while feeding some treats. She went right back into her kennel. When I finished with Mann and sat on the tree stump he went for a run. He went to the back and I watched the GPS to know where he was. I called him a few times and he came back to be put up.

Boss and I are still butting heads. He won’t take a treat while we are doing the retrieve training. But standing on his dog house, after I put him back, he can’t get enough of them.

The stump, near the kennel, that I have Sally and Boss jump onto with their retrieve.

This morning I heeled him out of his kennel to near the tree stump. I’ve been throwing a tennis ball and when they pick it up I have them jump onto the tree stump. I pet them then say, “give” and take the tennis ball. The first time this morning he went to the ball, slowly, and touched it with his nose. Didn’t try to pick it up. I held the button on the e-collar down on level 2 until he opened his mouth and picked the ball up. I walked to the tree stump with him at heel and he jumped onto the stump. I petted him and when I took the ball from him I offered a treat. He licked it then turned his head.

After the first time he walked to the ball, picked it up and stood there. I quit heeling him to the stump. I dropped the end of the Wonder lead and went to the stump. He came when I called him and jumped onto the stump. I petted him for several seconds then said, “give” and took the ball. We did this 6 or 7 times and he seemed a little happier about me dropping the Wonder lead and letting him go to the stump without my control.

Sally waiting for me to take the dummy and give her a treat.

I let him run to the back then through the front yard and back to the kennel. He doesn’t hold a grudge. When we get back to the kennel I sit on the stump and he crawls into my lap. He doesn’t want treats, just petting.

I could get really heavy handed and make him do this a lot faster but I’m afraid it would take something out of him. I’ve got lots of time to train this and we will go at whatever speed he wants.

Abby loves the treats and she will do whatever it takes to get them. For her I just stand at the stump and throw the tennis ball and she goes after it, scoops it up and comes back to the stump. This morning she couldn’t wait for the treat. She dropped the ball as soon as she was on the stump. I heeled her off the stump and said, “fetch”. She grabbed the ball and jumped back on the stump where she almost immediately dropped the ball. I led her off the stump with the Wonder lead and said, “fetch”. She picked it up and jumped back on the stump. This time she held it until I said, “give”. I took the ball and gave her a treat.

Boss pointing a pigeon.

I threw the tennis ball for her 6 or 7 times and she retrieved it each time and held until I said, “give” except for one time she didn’t see the ball as I threw it. As I started toward the ball she was really looking. She came close and smelled the ball and scooped it up. I walked back to the stump where she was waiting. She held until I said, “give”. I let her run to the back and when we got back to the kennel I put her up.

I cut up a hot dog in 18 or 20 pieces and if I have some left over I split them amongst all the dogs. Usually, I cut up one and a half hot dogs so I have left overs. Right now I’m watching a Lab pup for a friend so he gets some treats too. But the funny thing is I have offered Boss treats as we were training and he wouldn’t take any. But now when there is no training involved he is excited about the treats.

Mann with Boss honoring.

Right now we are working out who is in charge. He can quit and accept that I’m the one in charge anytime he wants but I can’t quit. I’m going to keep on, however long it takes. Maybe I shouldn’t have named him Boss.

I am still working Abby and Boss on the retrieving bench. They are progressing but at a really slow pace. They both move down the bench real slow, when sent to fetch, but Boss is slower than most turtles. So far I’m not doing anything as long as he makes an effort. If there is no effort the e-collar comes on at a low level. I only use level 2 or at most level 3 then right back to level 2. I have 4 dummies made with dowel rods, 2 dummies that are round plastic and 1 Dokken dove dummy. I have quail, chukar and dove dummies by Dokken and I use the dove because it’s the smallest of the Dokken dummies.

The set up on the retrieving bench.

Boss with a plastic dummy.

Abby with a plastic dummy.

Both of these dogs will reach past the Dokken dove dummy to grab a dowel dummy. For me, as long as they are grabbing something when I say, “fetch”, I’m okay with it. Sometimes, not always, they grab the dowel dummies and they have 2 plastic dummies and a dove dummy to do last. They are resigned to the fact that they have to retrieve them but they are really slow.

After they retrieve each of the 7 dummies on the bench I spread the 4 dowel dummies, over about 30 yards, on the ground. I lift them off the bench and say, “whoa”, just as I put them on the ground. I hold a plastic dummy in front of them and say, “fetch”. When they take the plastic dummy I walk them in a large circle and they must hold the dummy until I say, “give”.

Abby is pretty good about holding the dummy, most of the time but Boss dropped his the last time we worked on this. I usually hold the transmitter in my hand so the instant they drop the dummy the stimulation comes on. They act like they can just barely feel level 2 and that’s what we start with. If they drop it more than once I go to level 3. That’s as high as I usually go. Only a couple of times have I had to go to level 4.

After we make our circle and are back to the start of the retrieving bench I have them hold for a few seconds then say, “give”. Most of the time they are ready to turn loose of the dummy. Then I heel them to the dowel dummies that are spread out on the ground. This exercise is kind of like a job for them. They seem to understand that we need to get the dummies put back. As I heel them toward the dummy I say, “fetch” just before we get to it. Boss is really slow but Abby picks it right up most of the time.

Boss just closes his mouth on the dummy without raising it very far but once I say, “heel” he raises it and comes along. His head is still down. When we get to the retrieving bench I have him stand in front of me. I wait for him to raise his head before I say, “give”. It varies on how long this takes but I will accept any upward movement. If he just raises his head an inch or so I lift his head and pet him then say “give”.

Sally racing back with a retrieve. She gets a treat when she does it correctly.

Abby usually raises her head to carry the dummy as well as to give it to me. But both of these dogs will do everything right one day then act like they have never seen a dummy before. But anyway we are slowly gaining ground and I think by bird season they will be retrieving fine.

In a past blog I talked about a guy having a dog that would just run. The dog covered a lot of ground but really didn’t care whether he was with his trainer or not. He really just needed the trainer to take him to some place to hunt. Now this guy, I wish I could remember who it was so I could give him the credit for this, decided to just follow the dog. He was on horse back so he would turn him loose in a large field and just follow the dog.

For several weeks every time he turned the dog loose, he followed. After several weeks the dog got used to the horse and rider being behind him, so he worked to stay in front of the horse.

Sally retrieving the Dokken quail.

After I work my dogs on retrieving, Mann and Sally on 4 or 5 retrieves and Abby and Boss on the bench, I let them run. Abby and Sally would run toward the back, and they knew there were no birds out, so they would stop and eat grass or roll in something. I quit just riding on to the back and would wait on them. If they were eating grass I would tone their e-collar and tell them to come on.

Mann and Boss get plenty of exercise each time but Sally and Abby didn’t. After a couple of weeks of me waiting on them, both of these dogs are running much better and mostly staying to the front. Neither of these dogs are a problem in a hunting situation but I really wanted them to run more than they were here. Now both of these dogs are getting much more exercise than before.

Boss pointing a pigeon.

I have to be really careful with the male dogs. When I turn them loose they really run. When we get to the back they will circle the very back then it’s a race to the front of the house. Both of these dogs, usually, are running way ahead of me when I slow to cross the wet weather creek that crosses my place. Getting them to quit when I want them to is the problem. During these really hot days I can’t let them run very long.

These “dog” days of summer is making it tough to work dogs at all. When it’s 80 at 6 am I hate to even get the dogs out. A couple of mornings I heeled Abby and Boss to the retrieving bench and then back to their kennel. I didn’t even take Sally and Mann out. I was afraid to let them have their happy timing. Oh, well. Fall always follows summer. It just seems like summer will never end.